The Glasshouse

Kay Greyson: I think, I think Newcastle is the best place on earth to perform as a musician, and you can quote me on that. Newcastle has such an energy in and of itself. Manifests itself in us being up for a party and that, but I think that’s too simple. We’re a small city with like broad shoulders, do you know what I mean?

Frankie Jobling: That’s really beautiful, thank you.
Frankie: Hello and welcome to Music Lives Here, the podcast from The Glasshouse which celebrates the eclectic and endlessly versatile music scene here in Newcastle and Gateshead. I’m Frankie Jobling, and in each episode it’s my pleasure to invite artists from all genres to share the storeys behind their relationship with music and their connection to the North East. Today I’m here with a pioneer of hip-hop music here in the North East, Kay Grayson.

Frankie: It’s a very bright and nippy day in the Toon. There’s blue skies stretched out and the spring birdies are singing away. It’s very windy. The sun’s just dipping down behind the Tyne Bridge now. It’s catching the river, it’s making it all shimmery, and it’s also spilling into the floor of The Glasshouse. We’re just in the entrance of the Tyne Bridge side, people watching. It’s lovely to see you again.

Kay: Hi! How’s it going?

Frankie: How you doing?

Born and raised in the West End of Newcastle, Kay’s witty, socially conscious lyrics and powerhouse live performances have landed her stages from BBC Introducing to MOBO Fringe shows, all while carrying the heart, humour, and hustle of her Geordie roots. From her gritty early house party shows to her acclaimed 2024 album Chekov’s Gun – with a cheeky feature from me – and collaborations that span NCL to LA, she’s proven herself to be one of the most exciting artists on the rise. I can’t wait to get into it.

Frankie: So, Kate, it’s good to see you again. I think the last time I saw you, we were recording.

Kay: Yes.

Frankie: Yeah, it’s great to have this time with you now. Welcome to the Music Lives Here podcast.
Kay: Happy to be here.

Frankie: Very happy to have you. So let’s start by diving straight in. Now, on this podcast, it’s really all about the music. More importantly, why music matters. So I thought you could tell me a little bit about what music means to you here. And what your connection to this beautiful venue is?

Kay: Well, music means a lot of things to me, but mostly it’s community, it’s connection, it’s joy. And a place like The Glasshouse is, it’s a place especially for young artists where when they get invited to come perform here or even attend gigs here, it feels like an event, it feels like a moment, you know, and it just emphasises that joy and that connection and that community. You know, I remember being with young artists and seeing them see themselves on the screen or see their name on the screen when they’ve been billed to perform. And you know, that moment of real like, oh, you know, I’m in a place that really values music and my music is being valued here. So yeah, I’d say that’s kind of what it means to me.

Frankie: That’s lush. Thank you. Let’s come back to The Glasshouse in a little while because I want to hear more about that. But before we do, I want to hear more about you and your relationship to music. So let’s talk motivation and inspiration.

Kay has such a unique sound. It’s got the energy of modern hip-hop but the sort of substance and conscious edge you usually only find in old-school raps. A true blend of lyrical dexterity, of personality, and of message. Part Childish Gambino, part Mos Def, yet with an identity all of her own. I want to know where this sound came from, what her process looks like, and what drives her to make the sort of songs she’s known for.

When I hear your music, it makes me think of so many different artists. I think you yourself actually mentioned it being inspired by the likes of Eminem and Kendrick Lamar, as well as how much your family have inspired a love for music in you. I was really interested to hear about how you grew up surrounded by Soca music and Caribbean house parties. I think your dad was in a band as well?

Kay: Yep, yep.
Frankie: And how that lot has fed into your sound today?

Kay: So, um, my dad played with loads and loads of different bands when I was young, so it just meant like in the house there was constant music playing. He once turned up with about 24 djembés and announced that they lived in the hallway, which my mam was really, really happy about, and that was the change she wanted in the home. So that was great. So there was always drumming, there was always music being played around me, and oftentimes it was, you know, traditional Caribbean Caribbean music and traditional Soca music, which is very lyrical and fun. And, you know, the music’s there for people to follow along to the beat and like sing along to. So when I started to write music and create music, that was what I wanted people to do. So like, the beat is there if you want to lose yourself in the beat and throw some shapes. I’m definitely up for that. But following along with the lyrics and, you know, them being political stories but told in a way where people can laugh and people can you know, relate to it in the way that they feel about things. It doesn’t feel like I’m telling you this, it’s like, you know, this is how I see things, maybe you see things the same way.

So, um, yeah, it’s a very, very exciting thing to be surrounded by, is like that traditional type of music. And it sort of branches on to listening to lots of ’70s and ’80s funk and soul and reggae music that, you know, both my mam and dad were listening to. So yeah, it was always a jam.

Frankie: Sounds good, it sounds fun. So have you always been a performer?

Kay: I’ve definitely always been a performer in one way or another. Whether I’ve always been a good performer is a different question, but I’ve definitely grown into it. Performance is the thing I enjoy more than anything in the world. So always feeling like I had the opportunity to jump up on stage and do something, if there was a moment to do that, I was ready to go. It’s strange because I was quite a nervous kid, but sort of once I discovered hip-hop music and got into writing and rapping, like, it kind of all changed. Like, that was my thing to be like, oh, I might not be confident to hold a conversation with you, but I’ll show you this rap I wrote two nights ago, you know. So yeah, so definitely been a performer at heart before I was a performer in trade. But it was, it’s— I’ve definitely loved that journey.

Frankie: Yeah

Kay: It’s interesting because when I was younger I was very much writing. Like, I’m quite a confident person, but I always say, like, confidence is earned. So when I was younger, like, I would very much lean into performing and rapping and writing because it was a way to sort of pretend to be more confident than I was.

And then eventually, like, I kind of forgot that I was pretending and just became a confident person. Yeah, so like, I kind of forgot the fear. So it was a case of like, I was writing what I, how I wanted to be, like the whole braggadocious and like, you know, I don’t care, I’m here, you know, was very much just me manifesting the person I wanted to be. And talking a little bit about, like I did as I got older, start speaking a bit more about sort of the environment around me and things like that. And that did definitely start from being younger, but I feel like the inspirations are the same, but the content has just matured in a sense of I don’t really need to like, you know, pretend to be this person or that person. Like I can just be me, I’ve, I’ve earned these things and I’ve become this, this sort of manifestation of myself, you know. So it’s, it’s interesting. It’s like, I feel like me and 14-year-old me would still have a really good cypher.

Frankie: That would be so cool. Have you got videos and stuff of it?

Kay: So many videos, so many videos. I’ve got videos of me in like my school uniform, like rapping. And I was so— I mean, I, I do swear in my music now, but I was so sweary back then. It was like, I watch it now, I’m like, you just too much.

Frankie: That’s why you didn’t invite your mam.

Kay: Exactly, exactly. You know, I was like, Mam, I’m trying to get a rep here, you know. But the funniest part was that I’d been like— I don’t know if I was like grounded or something, like lateness has always been my issue, so I was, I was coming up late for curfew and things like that. And, I’d ended up joining this like youth project in the West End and started like rapping there. And so, but I had to go straight from school because if I went home I was cooked. So like, I went straight to this like youth project, but they were, ended up being like some like local rappers that were there that night. So we did a cypher. So cypher got filmed and I’m there rapping in my school uniform. It got filmed and my mam ended up finding this video ’cause I was watching it, showing it to everyone. Like I just baited myself out completely. And my mam ended up finding it. I was like, “Oh, I’m done, I’m finished.” And she loved it so much. She went to work, she was showing her friends at work and it’s just me, like just swearing my head off rapping. And she was like, yeah, but look how happy you are. And I was, I was like, oh my God. So from then it was like, oh, sort of it became like a team thing. I felt like I didn’t have to hide it from her anymore, you know, because she was just so into what I was doing because I was happy doing it, you know. So yeah, that’s kind of—

Frankie: She sounds so proud.

Kay: It was pretty wholesome.

Frankie: Yeah, that is, it’s so nice. I think you’ve mentioned your mam in some interviews and how she works in the community in the West End, and she’s always taught you to lift up the place that you’re from. How do you think you’re doing that at the moment?

Kay: So it’s, it’s amazing because, like, I grew up watching— like, my mam always worked within the community and always, you know, was about giving opportunities to people who wouldn’t have access to those opportunities otherwise. And that, I think that just got its hooks in me without me ever really realising until I was a little bit older. So at the minute, and for the, for the past quite a few years now. I’ve been working with Northern Roots, who are an absolutely amazing organisation in the North East, and they do loads of different programmes working with young people and older people as well to sort of just chase their dreams. But it’s, it’s all very participant-led. So we’re doing a programme at the minute called Trailblazer where we’re working with young artists and pairing young artists with mentors who are still quite close to them, you know, in experience and, and things like that, so that the advice is very tailor-made. And like I say, participant-led, so if there’s anything that they want to do within their careers, you know, it’s having that person there where you can go, ‘How do I set up a funding application? How do I do this?’ You know, and you’ve got that direct link to someone who’s done it before.

So we do stuff like that, we do showcases, so I’ve been very, very proud of the showcases at the minute. Georgia May, another amazing artist, she’s working with us to sort of put those together and curate them and promote them. She’s doing great. I saw her at the weekend giving out flyers, and yeah, I was very— I loved it. But yeah, so we’re a small team, but we, we do do a lot of, a lot of stuff. And the showcases at Pilgrim have been amazing, just new acts and getting them on there and giving them a chance to perform to an audience, you know, who’s ready to see them perform. You know, it takes me back to when I was doing like the Genesis Elijah gig, like having that audience who’s there for you and your genre is just such a, such a moment. So giving that moment to, to young artists and, and being… The main thing with Northern Roots is we want to be long-term support. So we have, we’ve had a lot of things in the North East that are there and then gone, and you can’t really like build, you can’t build off that, you know. But year in, year out, being there, like, you want to do your first gig with us, great. You want to do a gig with us in 3 years’ time, great, we’re still here, you know. And just providing that that long-term sort of scaffolding for, for young artists to build.

Frankie: That’s so important.

Kay: Yeah.

Frankie: So just moving on from that, I’d love you to tell me a bit about a verse of yours from a song that I believe you performed here. Would you mind reading this out for us?

Kay: Of course, of course. So this is a verse I wrote for Heaven Help Us All that we did with the Voices of Virtue Gospel Choir. So I’m gonna rap it.

[Rapping] Heaven help us all and deliver me to freedom. In my mind, the spirit of the fallen spitting. I can feel him, see visions of what was missing. Why’d he leave us when we need him? Why did nobody listen till we were broken and bleeding? Breaking past every ceiling ain’t even making it even. I’m just asking that you carry all the wounded in the healing. Souls be hungry for the word, and I heard that we can feed them till the day we pray and see the gates, the day that we can meet him. People have been divided, reminded that we are one. Been screaming but hearing silence, been crying out for the sun, but the light will touch us all. Fight, he won’t let us fall. Black or white will hear the call. Raining down from above. Ain’t no shock, the answer is love. Every religion, creed, or colour won’t judge no matter the colour. Nobody deserves to suffer. Sister protecting sister and brother protecting brother, looking out for one another with heaven helping us all.

Frankie: So good.

Kay: I love that verse.

Frankie: Yeah, it’s amazing. It’s so good. It’s amazing that you performed that here because it’s not really the type of music people might associate with The Glasshouse. How did you find that?

Kay: It was great. You know, I think coming into spaces and being able to— doesn’t necessarily have to shock the audience, but maybe just divert their expectations a little bit is a really beautiful thing about being involved in genres like gospel music, you know, that people might not be used to hearing outside of like a church setting. So being able to come here and obviously with the amazing Voices of Virtue Choir, you know, and being able to perform this verse specifically, was a really, really amazing experience. And being able to see the reaction to people who, you know, they get into the choir, they’re like, oh, choir’s singing, and then a rapper comes out, it’s like, oh, now the choir’s rapping. So, you know, it’s like just subverting that expectation again, which is something I’m really into. So yeah, it was brilliant.

Frankie: Yeah, it sounds amazing.

Kay: Yeah.

Frankie: And do you think the audience received it well?

Kay: I think, I think they definitely did, the ones that I could see didn’t look disgusted. So that was, yeah. And obviously you get them sort of compliments of people coming up and saying, oh, that was great, wasn’t expecting to see something like that. Or, you know, maybe like, this isn’t the kind of music I would usually listen to, but I like really enjoyed the performance. So I like hearing stuff like that after gigs. So it’s good.

Frankie: Lush, just off the back of that, for people who are coming fresh to your music, what can they expect? Where would you want them to start?

Kay: I would definitely say to start with Chekhov’s Gun. Which is the album that features yourself. Definitely check out that album, because that’s sort of the story so far. Like, I would say that’s kind of like the prologue to what’s coming next, which is great. And yeah, you know, and obviously there’s all— I’m always freestyling on Instagram, so you can always cheque that out. But if you’re gonna listen to the music, definitely start with Chekhov’s Gun.

Frankie: Nice, thank you. You’re listening to Music Lives Here, recorded on location in The Glasshouse. I’m with the legendary Geordie rapper Kay Grayson, who’s telling me why this city and this space means so much to them. I love how far back your relationship to this place goes. It was amazing to hear about the performance at The Glasshouse with the Voices of Virtue gospel choir. That wasn’t the first time that you played here though, was it?

Kay: No, it wasn’t.

Frankie: What is it that keeps bringing you back here? Is it the audiences that The Glasshouse attracts? Is it the culture, the acoustics?

Kay: It’s interesting, sort of like I grew up so close to The Glasshouse and always been sort of around this area. And, you know, it is such a staple of the, of the region. But I got an opportunity to perform here actually very early on in my career, which is amazing. It was actually my first proper official gig. I got booked to support hip-hop legend Genesis Elijah, which I think is not what you would expect. I mean, it definitely at that time wasn’t what I would expect to be sort of billed here. But then being asked to perform— I think I was about 13— and asked to perform with, with him was unbelievable and very sort of transformative for my career at the time. It just felt like the first time being like sort of like stamp of approval, like, yeah, you know. And we performed up in the central room and it was unbelievable. It was really like— it’s that thing, it’s like you say, the acoustics, the culture. It was— and it was inviting in other cultures to sort of lend their vibe and their knowledge to the place. That really sort of showed me the beauty of what’s happening here.

You know, it’s, it’s The Glasshouse, but it’s also a hub. You know, people can bring themselves as themselves here, which was amazing because I’m standing there listening to, you know, a legendary hip-hop and MC, you know, like of the— in the purest way, and sort of then being able to do my version of that, you know, and watching, you know, people dancing along to it, young people dancing along. Like, it was a, it was a really beautiful, beautiful moment. And I think there’s obviously the memory of that moment that brings me back here still with an excitement that I had when I was younger. But also when I’m asked to perform here, it’s often for, you know, gigs that are a little bit different, a little bit out the box, things that are happening that are quite special for the region. You know, for example, most recently the MOBOs, doing the MOBO Fringe here. That was like just a really magical thing, and it felt like I was here with like all of my friends and peers, and everybody had their 15 minutes, you know, which is just such a rare thing out this is such a rare thing, something that maybe hasn’t happened before, you know, here. So yeah, so I think, I think it’s a combination of all of those things, and obviously the memory of feeling included here, that really keeps drawing me back.

Frankie: That’s really special. Thank you. As well as The Glasshouse, I know you’ve played in LA and you’ve done tours in Germany. It sounds like you’ve played in so many different places and to so many different audiences. But you’re Newcastle born and bred and you’re proud of it. What is it that makes the music scene here so distinctive, especially when it comes to hip-hop?

Kay: I think the scene here is in a constant state of growth. You know, Geordies are inventive and, you know, intuitive people and very like, you can’t keep us out of anything, you know, if we want to be in it, we’ll be in it, you know, and that’s across everything. So the scene here, it is scrappy, it is people being like, even if I’ve got 10 minutes, I’m gonna jump on and do my show and, you know, really give it my all. And it’s all based around energy and caring about the music. Like, when I first started, I was doing like very like low-key gigs, you know. So, I know it’s, it’s a bad word to say, but I was in Sunderland, doing some events. So there was a promoter at the time, I was about 12 years old, a promoter at the time who got in touch with me and was like, you know, I was putting freestyles up on Facebook and everything. So the promoter’s like, would you like to come down and, and do this gig in like a social club in Sunderland? And I was like, obviously, that is the home of my music, off we go.

So it was very like, you know, I was obviously— I could never tell my mam, I couldn’t tell her I was going to Sunderland, let alone, you know, at night to do a gig in a social club, you know. So, I would like come out of school in my school uniform, get on the Metro, go straight to the gig. If I’m already out I can’t be took in. So, I would go to these, like, I went to this club. I remember the first time I went to do it, I went to go to this club and it was— I was getting £20, so I was rich. And, I turned up and got on the stage, got the mic, and I’m standing there and I start rapping this song written in my bedroom 3 nights earlier. And, and it was like, when you looked at— I see a crowd, you know, that’s a strong word— but, when you looked at the people who were there, it was like a couple of little tables and people sat there and like older blokes. And then this one guy in the back gave me the best performance advice I’ve ever gotten in my life. Just mid-song, he just went, ‘Here, pet, look up.’ And I looked up and I’ve never looked down on stage again. I was terrified. But it was that thing of it being about connection. It comes back to it being about connection. And yeah, and they were like the first like early gigs I did. And you know, it led to me doing stuff like that in Newcastle. And then, you know, as the years going on, stuff like that, all around the world. But the, the essence stays the same. You’ve got to look up.

Frankie: Yeah, it’s great advice. Really good advice. Especially the pet.

Kay: Sure he was being nice. Yeah.

Frankie: Helping emerging North East artists is really important to us at The Glasshouse, and I know it’s important to you as well. You’re supporting a project for new artists at the moment called Trailblazers.

Kay: Yeah.
Frankie: Could you tell me a bit about that?

Kay: Yeah, so that’s involved with the work I’m doing with Northern Roots at the minute. So we’re working with young artists who are just at that point where they’re pushing through with their career, and you know, you hit that ceiling where it’s like, okay, I’ve played a few gigs, I’ve put out a couple of songs, what happens now? You know, and just sort of coming along with a little bit of like really participant-led support, you know. What is it that you need? Do you need to learn about business? Do you need to learn about tax? Do you need to learn about, you know, how you put together a gig contract, like, or, or do you need to book more gigs? Like, do you need to get introduced to people? So whatever it might be, just sort of tailoring that support towards the artists, which is sort of the, the theme of everything we do with Northern Roots. It’s all about sort of what the young people need. So yeah, it’s been really rewarding and really fun, you know. We’re a little bit into it, and we’ve definitely seen a change in what the artists have been able to achieve.

Sometimes it’s not even, it’s not even really about us giving the support. Sometimes it’s just about knowing there’s someone to go to if you have those questions. So yeah, they’ve been, for the, for Trailblazers, they’ve definitely been blazing the trail.

Frankie: That sounds like really important work. And for people listening who aspire to be one of those voices up on stage with you, have you got any pieces of advice you could offer them?

Kay: I absolutely do. So the best bit of advice that I can give any emerging artists other than “Look up pet” is, to get involved in everything. Go to everything, you know. Some of the best opportunities I’ve ever been given is because I turned up somewhere that it was unexpected for me to be there, or it wasn’t something that I was maybe have been particularly invited to or asked to go and perform at, you know. I just went there and made myself a fan, made myself a face in the, in the local scene, you know, that— in that gig, studio sessions, you know, little meetings, arrange to meet up with people, you know. People are 9 times out of 10 willing to go for a coffee or a pint, you know. So it’s that connection, making yourself a face. And if you’ve got the passion, you know, and you want to make music and, you’ve got that energy behind you, people will feed off that when you turn up and you’re there in person, you know. We’ve got a real reliance on social media at the minute, and that’s great, but that face-to-face connection can’t be beaten, so turn up to everything.

Frankie: Thank you, it’s very inspiring. I’ll take that on board myself, I think. Before I let you go, I’ve got a quote here that I love from you in Narc Magazine. You say, “I’ve dreamed since I was a kid of signing a record deal, and being able to do it as a female queer Geordie rapper, that’s a win to me”. Could you provide any advice for someone that’s coming from a background like that who might feel feel sometimes that the odds are against them?

Kay: Yeah, absolutely. It’s all about breaking down barriers and breaking down walls. And the sad part about the world that we live in is sometimes, even though it’s not your responsibility, you’ve got to be that person to put your head through the wall and go running through the barriers. Me when I was younger, I was— the first ever gig I ever did was an audition for Universal Music, the record label, and I was 11 years old and I got asked to go and perform, and I turned up and I had my lyrics and I’d been practising, and I was ready for that gig. Walked in and they told me that they weren’t looking for girls, you know. And that’s when I realised I was the only girl in the room. I hadn’t realised that before. I looked around, I was like— and at 11 years old, I had to make a choice. I had to go, right, am I either going to leave and be like, oh well, you know, I tried, or I’m just going to start rapping and I’m going to do this gig anyway because that’s what I came here to do, you know.

Kay: And me as a kid, I made the choice to just perform. I was like, well, I want to do it anyway, you know. You’re not going to sign me, okay, you know. Well, they definitely weren’t going to sign us because I wasn’t very good when I was 11, but I had put the practise in and I wanted to do my bit, you know. So I went up there and I performed anyway, and I actually got asked to do an encore, and I did the encore as well. So it’s that thing of it’s not your responsibility to break down those barriers, but sometimes it’s your— it’s something you have to do, you know, in, in the moment. Like, you’ll know. And it’s a motivation for myself as much as I hope it would be a motivation for other people. But me, at that young age, if I was able to do it then, then I’m able to do it 10 times a week now, you know. And just that feeling of knowing that I might be breaking open that door for the person standing behind me who wants to come through it as you know. So I would definitely say just keep breaking down walls.

Frankie: It’s very inspiring. I feel like you started rapping and you just never stopped.

Kay: That’s what everyone says.

Frankie: It’s great. You should just go for what you love. That’s what’s coming across. Finally then, just before we let you get on your way, I know listeners will be excited to know what’s next for you, what’s coming up.

Kay: So at the minute, I’m creating my second album. Putting together a body of work inspired by myself, my world travels, and the people around me. So that’s going to be really exciting, and hopefully something from that will come out this year. I don’t know if it’ll be the album, I’m not going to promise that, but something will come out from that this year. So that’s what I’m working on at the minute.

Frankie: Amazing, I’m buzzing to hear that. Finally then, what comes to mind in terms of something that really helped you when you were starting out, other than, you know, just doing it yourself and not taking no for an answer.

Kay: I think something that really helped me when I was starting out was outside of what I was doing as far as, you know, writing and really falling in love with the music and sort of the craft of songwriting and hip-hop in general, was sort of having people around me that were passionate about things. But that was the most important thing. Growing up, I had my mam, obviously. I was very blessed to have and she used to work in the community, and she really taught me that the most important thing, you know, is really uplifting the place you live, uplifting the place you are, and especially as a very proud Geordie woman, that comes on 10 times more. And her work in the community really, you know, sort of held my hand to lead me into community work as well as the music stuff that I was doing. And outside of that, having a group of friends who, they’re not all rappers, despite what they might think. But, you know, they have passions in dance and photography and art, and that might not be your group. You might have a group of passionate accountants or a group of passionate lawyers around you, or whoever it might be. But surrounding yourself by people who are passionate about the things that you’re doing is the most important thing. You can gain a lot of inspiration by being around people who are inspired.

Frankie: Thank you. Finally then, immediate future, what are you doing right now?

Kay: So I’m incredibly jet-lagged. I’ve been on a flight back from LA yesterday, so right now I’m gonna find a bed and sleep in it.

Frankie: Nice. I feel like I would like a little nap too, so can I tag along, please?

Kay: Absolutely. Woo-hoo! I love that.

Frankie: I love talking to Kay, and I had no idea that The Glasshouse has been so important into her early career. I had no idea that she’s been performing from such a young age at social clubs, and I had no idea that she had a new album on the way, so that’s really exciting. I’ve had a blast, and I hope you have too. If you have, tell your friends, send us a like, and don’t forget to subscribe so you never miss an episode.
Music Lives Here is brought to you by The Glasshouse International Centre for Music, a home for music lovers with gigs, concerts, and classes every week in Gateshead Quays, out in communities across the North East, and online. Anyone can join us in creating and celebrating outstanding music. Music lives and grows here.

Once again, my thanks to the incredible and inspiring Kay Grayson.

I’m Frankie Jobling, the producer is Jacob Dabb, and the executive producers are Debbie Kilbride and Jo Rowntree. The gorgeous music behind me was composed by Chad Rogers. This has been a Loftus Media production, and until next time, gan canny.